gorgias-第11部分

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ve　the　largest　coat；　and　the　greatest　number　of　them；　and　go　about　clothed　in　the　best　and　finest　of　them？　　　Cal。　Fudge　about　coats！　　　Soc。　Then　the　skilfullest　and　best　in　making　shoes　ought　to　have　the　advantage　in　shoes；　the　shoemaker；　clearly；　should　walk　about　in　the　largest　shoes；　and　have　the　greatest　number　of　them？　　　Cal。　Fudge　about　shoes！　What　nonsense　are　you　talking？　　　Soc。　Or；　if　this　is　not　your　meaning；　perhaps　you　would　say　that　the　wise　and　good　and　true　husbandman　should　actually　have　a　larger　share　of　seeds；　and　have　as　much　seed　as　possible　for　his　own　land？　　　Cal。　How　you　go　on；　always　talking　in　the　same　way；　Socrates！　　　Soc。　Yes；　Callicles；　and　also　about　the　same　things。　　　Cal。　Yes；　by　the　Gods；　you　are　literally　always　talking　of　cobblers　and　fullers　and　cooks　and　doctors；　as　if　this　had　to　do　with　our　argument。　　　Soc。　But　why　will　you　not　tell　me　in　what　a　man　must　be　superior　and　wiser　in　order　to　claim　a　larger　share；　will　you　neither　accept　a　suggestion；　nor　offer　one？　　　Cal。　I　have　already　told　you。　In　the　first　place；　I　mean　by　superiors　not　cobblers　or　cooks；　but　wise　politicians　who　understand　the　administration　of　a　state；　and　who　are　not　only　wise；　but　also　valiant　and　able　to　carry。　out　their　designs；　and　not　the　men　to　faint　from　want　of　soul。　　　Soc。　See　now；　most　excellent　Callicles；　how　different　my　charge　against　you　is　from　that　which　you　bring　against　me；　for　you　reproach　me　with　always　saying　the　same；　but　I　reproach　you　with　never　saying　the　same　about　the　same　things；　for　at　one　time　you　were　defining　the　better　and　the　superior　to　be　the　stronger；　then　again　as　the　wiser；　and　now　you　bring　forward　a　new　notion；　the　superior　and　the　better　are　now　declared　by　you　to　be　the　more　courageous：　I　wish；　my　good　friend；　that　you　would　tell　me　once　for　all；　whom　you　affirm　to　be　the　better　and　superior；　and　in　what　they　are　better？　　　Cal。　I　have　already　told　you　that　I　mean　those　who　are　wise　and　courageous　in　the　administration　of　a　state…they　ought　to　be　the　rulers　of　their　states；　and　justice　consists　in　their　having　more　than　their　subjects。　　　Soc。　But　whether　rulers　or　subjects　will　they　or　will　they　not　have　more　than　themselves；　my　friend？　　　Cal。　What　do　you　mean？　　　Soc。　I　mean　that　every　man　is　his　own　ruler；　but　perhaps　you　think　that　there　is　no　necessity　for　him　to　rule　himself；　he　is　only　required　to　rule　others？　　　Cal。　What　do　you　mean　by　his　〃ruling　over　himself〃？　　　Soc。　A　simple　thing　enough；　just　what　is　commonly　said；　that　a　man　should　be　temperate　and　master　of　himself；　and　ruler　of　his　own　pleasures　and　passions。　　　Cal。　What　innocence！　you　mean　those　fools…the　temperate？　　　Soc。　Certainly：…any　one　may　know　that　to　be　my　meaning。　　　Cal。　Quite　so；　Socrates；　and　they　are　really　fools；　for　how　can　a　man　be　happy　who　is　the　servant　of　anything？　On　the　contrary；　I　plainly　assert；　that　he　who　would　truly　live　ought　to　allow　his　desires　to　wax　to　the　uttermost；　and　not　to　chastise　them；　but　when　they　have　grown　to　their　greatest　he　should　have　courage　and　intelligence　to　minister　to　them　and　to　satisfy　all　his　longings。　And　this　I　affirm　to　be　natural　justice　and　nobility。　To　this　however　the　many　cannot　attain；　and　they　blame　the　strong　man　because　they　are　ashamed　of　their　own　weakness；　which　they　desire　to　conceal；　and　hence　they　say　that　intemperance　is　base。　As　I　have　remarked　already；　they　enslave　the　nobler　natures；　and　being　unable　to　satisfy　their　pleasures；　they　praise　temperance　and　justice　out　of　their　own　cowardice。　For　if　a　man　had　been　originally　the　son　of　a　king；　or　had　a　nature　capable　of　acquiring　an　empire　or　a　tyranny　or　sovereignty；　what　could　be　more　truly　base　or　evil　than　temperanceto　a　man　like　him；　I　say；　who　might　freely　be　enjoying　every　good；　and　has　no　one　to　stand　in　his　way；　and　yet　has　admitted　custom　and　reason　and　the　opinion　of　other　men　to　be　lords　over　him？…must　not　he　be　in　a　miserable　plight　whom　the　reputation　of　justice　and　temperance　hinders　from　giving　more　to　his　friends　than　to　his　enemies；　even　though　he　be　a　ruler　in　his　city？　Nay；　Socrates；　for　you　profess　to　be　a　votary　of　the　truth；　and　the　truth　is　this：…that　luxury　and　intemperance　and　licence；　if　they　be　provided　with　means；　are　virtue　and　happiness…all　the　rest　is　a　mere　bauble；　agreements　contrary　to　nature；　foolish　talk　of　men；　nothing　worth。　　　Soc。　There　is　a　noble　freedom；　Callicles；　in　your　way　of　approaching　the　argument；　for　what　you　say　is　what　the　rest　of　the　world　think；　but　do　not　like　to　say。　And　I　must　beg　of　you　to　persevere；　that　the　true　rule　of　human　life　may　become　manifest。　Tell　me；　then：…you　say；　do　you　not；　that　in　the　rightly…developed　man　the　passions　ought　not　to　be　controlled；　but　that　we　should　let　them　grow　to　the　utmost　and　somehow　or　other　satisfy　them；　and　that　this　is　virtue？　　　Cal。　Yes；　I　do。　　　Soc。　Then　those　who　want　nothing　are　not　truly　said　to　be　happy？　　　Cal。　No　indeed；　for　then　stones　and　dead　men　would　be　the　happiest　of　all。　　　Soc。　But　surely　life　according　to　your　view　is　an　awful　thing；　and　indeed　I　think　that　Euripides　may　have　been　right　in　saying；

　　　　　Who　knows　if　life　be　not　death　and　death　life；

and　that　we　are　very　likely　dead；　I　have　heard　a　philosopher　say　that　at　this　moment　we　are　actually　dead；　and　that　the　body　（soma）　is　our　tomb　（sema）；　and　that　the　part　of　the　soul　which　is　the　seat　of　the　desires　is　liable　to　be　tossed　about　by　words　and　blown　up　and　down；　and　some　ingenious　person；　probably　a　Sicilian　or　an　Italian；　playing　with　the　word；　invented　a　tale　in　which　he　called　the　soul…because　of　its　believing　and　make…believe　nature…a　vessel；　and　the　ignorant　he　called　the　uninitiated　or　leaky；　and　the　place　in　the　souls　of　the　uninitiated　in　which　the　desires　are　seated；　being　the　intemperate　and　incontinent　part；　he　compared　to　a　vessel　full　of　holes；　because　it　can　never　be　satisfied。　He　is　not　of　your　way　of　thinking；　Callicles；　for　he　declares；　that　of　all　the　souls　in　Hades；　meaning　the　invisible　world　these　uninitiated　or　leaky　persons　are　the　most　miserable；　and　that　they　pour　water　into　a　vessel　which　is　full　of　holes　out　of　a　colander　which　is　similarly　perforated。　The　colander；　as　my　informer　assures　me；　is　the　soul；　and　the　soul　which　he　compares　to　a　colander　is　the　soul　of　the　ignorant；　which　is　likewise　full　of　holes；　and　therefore　incontinent；　owing　to　a　bad　memory　and　want　of　faith。　These　notions　are　strange　enough；　but　they　show　the　principle　which；　if　I　can；　I　would　fain　prove　to　you；　that　you　should　change　your　mind；　and；　instead　of　the　intemperate　and　insatiate　life；　choose　that　which　is　orderly　and　sufficient　and　has　a　due　provision　for　daily　needs。　Do　I　make　any　impression　on　you；　and　are　you　coming　over　to　the　opinion　that　the　orderly　are　happier　than　the　intemperate？　Or　do　I　fail　to　persuade　you；　and；　however　many　tales　I　rehearse　to　you；　do　you　continue　of　the　same　opinion　still？　　　Cal。　The　latter；　Socrates；　is　more　like　the　truth。　　　Soc。　Well；　I　will　tell　you　another　image；　which　comes　out　of　the　same　school：…Let　me　request　you　to　consider　how　far　you　would　accept　this　as　an　account　of　the　two　lives　of　the　temperate　and　intemperate　in　a　figure：…There　are　two　men；　both　of　whom　have　a　number　of　casks；　the　one　man　has　his　casks　sound　and　full；　one　of　wine；　another　of　honey；　and　a　third　of　milk；　besides　others　filled　with　other　liquids；　and　the　streams　which　fill　them　are　few　and　scanty；　and　he　can　only　obtain　them　with　a　great　deal　of　toil　and　difficulty；　but　when　his　casks　are　once　filled　he　has　need　to　feed　them　anymore；　and　has　no　further　trouble　with　them　or　care　about　them。　The　other；　in　like　manner；　can　procure　streams；　though　not　without　difficulty；　but　his　vessels　are　leaky　and　unsound；　and　night　and　day　he　is　compelled　to　be　filling　them；　and　if　he　pauses　for　a　moment；　he　is　in　an　agony　of　pain。　Such　are　their　respective　lives：…And　now　would　you　say　that　the　life　of　the　intemperate　is　happier　than　that　of　the　temperate？　Do　I　not　convince　you　that　the　opposite　is　the　truth？　　　Cal。　You　do　not　convince　me；　Socrates；　for　the　one　who　has　filled　himself　has　no　longer　any　pleasure　left；　and　this；　as　I　was　just　now　saying；　is　the　life　of　a　stone：　he　has　neither　joy　nor　sorrow　after　he　is　once　filled；　but　the　pleasure　depends　on　the　superabundance　of　the　influx。　　　Soc。　But　the　more　you　pour　in；　the　greater　the　waste；　and　the　holes　must　be　large　for　the　liquid　to　escape。　　　Cal。　Certainly。　　　Soc。　The　life　which　you　are　now　depicting　is　not　that　of　a　dead　man；　or　of　a　stone；　but　of　a　cormorant；　you　mean　that　he　is　to　be　hungering　and　eating？　　　Cal。　Yes。　　　Soc。　And　he　is　to　be　thirsting　and　drinking？　　　Cal。　Yes；　that　is　what　I　mean；　he　is　to　have　all　his　desires　about　him；　and　to　be　able　to　live　happily　in　the　gratification　of　them。　　　Soc。　Capital；　excellent；　go　on　as　you　have　begun；　and　have　no　shame；　I；　too；　must　disencumber　myself　of　shame：　and　first；　will　you　tell　me　whether　you　include　itching　and　scratching；　provided　you　have　enough　of　them　and　pass　your　life　in　scratching；　in　your　notion　of　happiness？　　　Cal。　What　a　strange　being　you　are；　Socrates！　a　regular　mob…orator。　　　Soc。　That　was　the　reason；　Callicles；　why　I　scared　Polus　and　Gorgias；　until　they　were　too　modest　to　say　what　they　thought；　but　you　will　not　be　too　modest　and　will　not　be　scared；　for　you　are　a　brave　man。　And　now；　answer　my　question。　　　Cal。　I　answer；　that　even　the　scratcher　would　live　pleasantly。　　　Soc。　And　if　pleasantly；　then　also　happily？　　　Cal。　To　be　sure。　　　Soc。　But　what　if　the　itching　is　not　confined　to　the　head？　Shall　I　pursue　the　question？　And　here；　Callicles；　I　would　have　you　consider　how　you　would　reply　if　consequences　are　pressed　upon　you；　especially　if　in　the　last　resort　you　are　asked；　whether　the　life　of　a　catamite　is　not　terrible；　foul；　miserable？　Or　would　you　venture　to　say；　that　they　too　are　happy；　if　they　only　get　enough　of　what　they　want？　　　Cal。　Are　you　not　ashamed；　Socrates；　of　introducing　such　topics　into　the　argument？　　　Soc。　Well；　my　fine　friend；　but　am　I　the　introducer　of　these　topics；　or　he　who　says　without　any　qualification　that　all　who　feel　pleasure　in　whatever　manner　are　happy；　and　who　admits　of　no　distinction　between　good　and　bad　pleasures？　And　I　would　still　ask；　whether　you　say　that　pleasure　and　good　are　the　sam